Protest to War against Iraq

[Shaftoe]

Originally posted by angrykitty


well...i'm not 100% sure what dev/null meant by eureka.

but i think it was pretty clear by what i meant by my statement.

today's leadership lacks imagination.

you might have a hair trigger there...

angrykitty, I was speaking directly in response to /dev/null's use of "eureka" as a reply to your comment about thinking creatively. Your statement was a good one, it was the implication of "See, SOMEBODY GETS IT" by /dev/null, when all his posts about Iraq have unequivocally supported war, which is an entirely noncreative and unoriginal means of addressing this problem (given the circumstances).

[nikel]

Originally posted by angrykitty
i saw him on tv last night, talking about the speech on some news show, he didn't impress me.

don't know much about him, would he make a good president?

i think mutterlein was referring to lieberman being a practicing jew, and that he could be the first jewish president.

[SexualWasabi]

Why do you all even give a shit? I don't see the fucking big deal over the word God and I'm an atheist. This is a Christian country like it or not, of course he is going to use that word.

Bush haters want to latch on to every insignificant piece of crap.

[phism]

Originally posted by frogbelly


Who mentioned Christians? We were talking about God. God could be my god or your god or a talking cloud or a goddamned tree stump.
Bush didn't have to swear on a Bible and say, "So help me God." But he did. He has the option not to as laid out in the section on the Presidential oath in the Constitution. There is your separation. In his speech(written by his spin doctors) he chose to invoke God's name which is his right which is also in the Constitution.

i don't mind him saying it in personal statements. like "so help me god"... but i'm talking about directly relating it to the united states, and incredibly often. it's obviously done on purpose.

again, this isn't a "Christian country"... as is also outlined in the Constitution. to make that assumption is close-minded. by that logic, you would then regard non-christians as unamerican. which i am willing to assume is bush's intent. the pledge of allegiance debate, or public opinion after 9-11, for example... how many idiots did you see on the news spouting "love it or leave it" crap?

is this also a white country and a heterosexual country? if so, where do the other millions fit?

[djbadmonkey]

Originally posted by SexualWasabi
Why do you all even give a shit? I don't see the fucking big deal over the word God and I'm an atheist. This is a Christian country like it or not, of course he is going to use that word.

Bush haters want to latch on to every insignificant piece of crap.

don't you mean

we are haters because BUSH is an insignificant piece of crap?

ok, so he's not insignificant but he is FOR SURE a piece of crap. perhaps worse. at least crap can be used for something.

[TheCoolie]

Consider:

Bush(or any president for that matter) says, "God", is partial to all monotheists, possibly offends polytheists and monists as well as offending atheists and agnostics.

Bush says "gods", is partial to polytheists and some monists, offends monotheists, atheists and agnostics

Bush says nothing, is partial to atheists and agnostics, while offending all groups subscribing to a higher truth.

[akuma]

whatever bush says or does and no matter how he does it or says it- it's gonna enfuriate the majority, no matter what majority it is.

remember it's bush we're talking about- he is the reincarnation of lucifer.

[wonki wonki]

...i wouldn't get too riled up over the usage of the word "god" in public political spectacles. it's more rooted in the american phenomenon of "civil religion" than in anything resembling a real religious conservatism. i'm not suggesting that there is no shift towards religious conservatism in this country, to the contrary. but this has little to do with invocations of god in politics, which is more firmly rooted in the perpetuation of american myth and the "god" more associated with the secularized version of post-Newtonian humanists.

having said that, sexualwasabi's claim that this is a christian country (which really has nothing to do with political usage of the word 'god') is ridiculous. as phism pointed out, it would be equally ridiculous to say this is a white country, like it or not, and whites are to deservedly excercize rhetorical monopoly.

..

[wonki wonki]

did someone mention "creative solutions"?

how about instead of deploying 150,000 troops to iraq (1) with their WEAPONS, why don't we send in 150,000 weapons INSPECTORS, with their INSPECTION EQUIPMENTS? (if getting rid of weapons of mass destructions is indeed our goal.)

i bet weapons inspectors will have an easier time getting access to suspected locations than u.s. soldiers. (they already do.)



oh... wait. that's not creative, that's OBVIOUS.

sorry!


==============
sources:
(1) http://www.csmonitor.com/2003/0130/p06s01-woiq.html

[Shaftoe]

Originally posted by wonki wonki
...i wouldn't get too riled up over the usage of the word "god" in public political spectacles. it's more rooted in the american phenomenon of "civil religion" than in anything resembling a real religious conservatism. i'm not suggesting that there is no shift towards religious conservatism in this country, to the contrary. but this has little to do with invocations of god in politics, which is more firmly rooted in the perpetuation of american myth and the "god" more associated with the secularized version of post-Newtonian humanists.

having said that, sexualwasabi's claim that this is a christian country (which really has nothing to do with political usage of the word 'god') is ridiculous. as phism pointed out, it would be equally ridiculous to say this is a white country, like it or not, and whites are to deservedly exercize rhetorical monopoly.

..

Agreed.

But Wonki, footnotes in message board posts? Yeesh. Don't expect me to post a footnote unless I am feeling really anal or somebody calls me on something. In which case I will happily provide attribution or admit that I was practicing rectal typing.

[SexualWasabi]

I meant that the majority of the people living in this country are Christians, it was created by Christians. I'm don't believe in God or Gods, we have a secular government. Just saying there is nothing wrong with saying God in a speech addressed to this nation. Yes there would be something wrong if he had said Allah, because this is not a Muslim country, he would have offended the majority of the population. Malaysia they do the same thing cept switched around... but the government of Malaysia is very secular... compared to other Islamic countries.

[wonki wonki]

Originally posted by Shaftoe
But Wonki, footnotes in message board posts? Yeesh. Don't expect me to post a footnote unless I am feeling really anal or somebody calls me on something. In which case I will happily provide attribution or admit that I was practicing rectal typing.

hahaha. i don't preach, brother, i just do.

(just a little promise i made a few pages back, in the hopes that it will raise the level of debate a bit.)

feel free to type or do anything else with your rectum..

..

[djbadmonkey]

Originally posted by SexualWasabi
Yes there would be something wrong if he had said Allah, because this is not a Muslim country, he would have offended the majority of the population.

a) why is there something wrong with it? what if he happened to be a muslim? so what you're saying is, is that to be president of the United States you have to be a christian cuz everyone else is? does the same apply for being white? most americans are white. does it apply to being middle class? most americans make a certain amount of money. sure you may get VOTED in because people are idiots (may i say again) and can only understand white x-ian men, and will only choose them as leaders...

b) your dualism here is then confusing because how is GOD not offensive to an "athiest" but Allah is? i think you should rename yourself to "Apologetic" or "spineless." or at least "inconsistent."

c) the country wasn't created by x-ians. most of the founding fathers were agnostics, truth be told. and most all of them freemasons. not exactly the most x-ian group in the world now is it? in terms of who built it? i won't get into that discussion but i know slaves and chinese laborers weren't xian until they had it forced upon them once they got here. bah imma get off my own religion's ass now.

[SexualWasabi]

Originally posted by djbadmonkey


a) why is there something wrong with it? what if he happened to be a muslim? so what you're saying is, is that to be president of the United States you have to be a christian cuz everyone else is? does the same apply for being white? most americans are white. does it apply to being middle class? most americans make a certain amount of money. sure you may get VOTED in because people are idiots (may i say again) and can only understand white x-ian men, and will only choose them as leaders...

b) your dualism here is then confusing because how is GOD not offensive to an "athiest" but Allah is? i think you should rename yourself to "Apologetic" or "spineless." or at least "inconsistent."

c) the country wasn't created by x-ians. most of the founding fathers were agnostics, truth be told. and most all of them freemasons. not exactly the most x-ian group in the world now is it? in terms of who built it? i won't get into that discussion but i know slaves and chinese laborers weren't xian until they had it forced upon them once they got here. bah imma get off my own religion's ass now.

Damn it, you liberals keep making up shit, DID I say I would have found him using the word Allah offensive? No, I would have actually found it stupid not offensive, because it does not make sense to use that word in his speech, it however does not matter if he does or does not use the word God in this country.

"so what you're saying is, is that to be president of the United States you have to be a Christian cuz everyone else is? does the same apply for being white? "

What the fuck? Where did you get that? No you don't have to be a Christian and why the hell do you keep bringing in white people into this? Did they pick on you? Or had an Asian girlfriend that you liked, but she only dates white people?

Now absurdities aside, are you offended because Bush used the word God in his speech?

[SexualWasabi]

Originally posted by yamchild


So you mean it's OK to offend a minority in the country, but it's not OK to offend the majority of the country?

I'm saying its ok to use the word God in his speech because the majority in this country would approve of it.